tv Lockup Raw MSNBC August 16, 2015 4:00am-4:31am PDT
i'm dara brown with breaking news. the associated press reports an official saying an indonesian airliner carrying 54 people has lost contact over the northeastern province of popua. the transportation ministry says the plane lost contact 33 minutes after takeoff and i'm joined on the phone with author of "contact providential" patrick smith.
they say there might be a weather issue, the reason the plane is missing? what do you know about this? >> look, it's very important not to speculate in the early aftermath of an aviation accident, and it's especially a bad idea to speculate this soon. i mean, we're talking literally minutes after the story of a missing airplane breaks. there's just so little to go on, this could be virtually anything. it's simply too early to start throwing out theories about what may have happened. it is interesting this is an indonesian airplane, and indonesia does have a spotty record when it comes to commercial aviation safety over the years, and this is looking like it's going to be probably another black mark on that country's record. you know, we could talk about that sort of thing, but exactly what happened, we have no idea, and it often takes a very long time, weeks, months, sometimes even years, before the causes of
specific accidents are nailed down. so we just have to be patient. >> we do know that the indonesia national rescue agency has been tweeting about this, and they've sent out a plane to go looking for this missing airliner. is that normal procedure? >> it is. and keep in mind, this happened in a remote area over papua new guinea rain forest, mountains. on top of that, there was reported bad weather. there will be a relatively extensive search, and it may take a while before the plane is found. >> we're joined by anthony roma. anthony, what can you add to this additional missing plane in indonesia? >> it is a very reliable aircraft. it is a jet engine with a propellor on it and basically made for short-range travel.
it is a modern aircraft and has a very good safety record. we do know in general, and although your other guest is absolutely correct, it's very early to speculate, we can look at the type of aircraft, in this case, the apr, and we can look at the environment that the aircraft is flying in. papua new guinea is some of the most difficult flying in the world because they do have areas of severe micro weather. that includes mountain waves, and mountain waves are just very large waves in the ocean that are caused by high winds, and in this case it would happen in the air. and that could cause extreme turbulence. they also have areas of fog and heavy rain and very dense jungle environment. so it can be very, very challenging flying even for
modern aircraft. but in this particular case, there is very little information to go on. we can understand where the last known position of the aircraft was, what type of weather was it flying through at the time, whether or not it's reached its next wait point, in other words, its next intended location of navigation. if it hasn't reached that, if it's over time and they've had no communication with the aircraft, if it was inside or outside of a radar environment, that would count very much. but enough is known about the missing aircraft, apparently, to alarm the authorities to begin a search for the aircraft. so that would create a lot of concern, and i can tell you, if this aircraft has gone down, and
it has gone down in a mountainous region, there are tremendous challenges facing the searchers. >> the associated press is reporting that the airline had lost contact with ground control, and we had mentioned that it's difficult with the terrain, you were talking about that. this twin turbo prop plane, howho how equipped is this? how are the technical skills, the technical devices on this plane? would a distress signal go out? would the pilot actually be able to contact and send out an alert system? how does this plane work? >> the commercial aircraft are required to have emergency locater beacons, and i'm sure this aircraft, too, was equipped with the emergency locater beacon that would send out a
signal to the geo satellite and provide its position if the aircraft suffered an impact of several g-forces that are exceeding, what would be expected when it underwent a normal landing. it's also equipped with the normal two-way communication equipment. it may have been in a radar environment or it may have been in an area where there was no radar available because of the mountainous region. also, radar can suffer anomalies due to very heavy rain. and it's basically called radar attenuati attenuation. >> if i may just interrupt for a minute, i know we had been speaking about this before, and i know patrick smith was also trying to weigh in on this, and
i also want to get to him to see what his comment would be on this. patrick, are you there? >> yeah, i am. i've actually flown the atm aircraft, i have several hundred hours in that aircraft, so i can attest to its reliability and sophistication. it's a turbo prop, propellor-driven aircraft, but it's a turbo prop. a sophisticated airplane. it has many of the same features that many larger jets have. i don't see the airplane itself as being an issue here, and i think it's also important to underscore that weather in and of itself, whether it's turbulence, clouds, rain, strong winds and so forth, weather in and of itself is not enough to bring a plane down. usually it's an error within the context of that bad weather, whether it's a crew error, air traffic controler, some combination of the two that is a result of the accident, not the weather itself. >> well, we know the plane was
flying, it was already 32 minutes into flight before it went off radar and lost contact with ground control. with just nine minutes left in flight, what was the procedure for that? >> that's a tough question because it really draws us into speculating and draws us into conjecture when we shouldn't be doing that because it's simply too early. this could be something weather related, as i was just saying, some sort of crew error in the context of that bad weather. there could have been some catastrophic malfunction. we just don't know. >> and anthony roman, if i can go back to you for a minute, we know there are 44 passengers, two infants, two children, five crew members aboard this plane. they reported it went missing 30 minutes after takeoff with just nine minutes left. what could they be doing on the ground to be searching for this from the airport where they would be landing?
any final comments on that? >> yes. it depends on whether they were in a radar environment or a non-radar environment. if they're in a non-radar environment, the flight crew would be required to report their position at particular navigation wait points. >> we'll be looking for that. and i'm sorry, thank you so much for joining us, patrick smith and anthony roman, we'll be following these details as details come in. thank you very much. ven stay strong! what's that? you want me to eat you? honey, he didn't say that! he did, very quietly... you can't hear from back there! don't fight your instincts. with each 150 calories or less, try our chocolatey brownies, tangy lemon bars and new creamy cheesecakes. fiber one. go on, have one! to breathe with copd?ow hard it can be it can feel like this.
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i go by doug. >> what is your nickname? >> what is my nickname? bozo. bozo the clown. >> why? >> why? i think it was because alex said i didn't have any hair. >> one day i was having a conversation with whitlow, and he said he had worked in a circus and that was his favorite job. it was ironic because of his laugh. out of nowhere, you would hear, ha, ha, ha. >> bozo whitlow had little in common with his crime. he was in prison for 16 years for rape and criminal confinement. when we saw his scars, it was clear his time in prison had
made his life anything but a circus. >> i was burned with hot baby oil and hair grease. it got all over my stomach. it burnt my stomach, it burnt my back, too, and i healed up pretty good but that's a permanent scar forever. >> w hirkhitlow claimed to not exactly who attacked him but he offered multiple possibilities for why it happened. >> whitlow constantly changed his story about what attacked him and why it happened. at one point he said he was actually defending a nurse who was the actual intended victim of this attack. >> someone threatened a gun on the nurse. i didn't want the nurse hurt, and i said, throw it on me. >> another time he told us it was an accident that had occurred, and at one point he even admitted that someone purposely tried to hurt him. >> i walked up to the bars because i thought someone had said, bozo, because that's what the guys call me. i went up to the bars, and
splash. they hit me with baby oil and hair grease and burnt my arm off, and i didn't see the person who did it because there was a lot of prisoners out, so i didn't see who it was. and i'm not the type that would tattletale on somebody, anyway, right? >> whitlow acknowledged what might be his biggest problem in prison. >> one of the problems and issues i had was talking a lot, excessive talking, going on and on a lot of times -- >> not only was whitlow a sex offender, he was a sex offender that constantly talked about his crime, and even his current behavior, which was disturbing. he talked about it to anybody who would listen, and this provoked the other inmates, in effect, to attack him. what did you feel? i know it's a stupid question, but what did you remember feeling? >> it was very painful. it was a lot of pain. but it was nothing like the pain i went through for a false charge for why i'm in here for
the last 13 years. >> whitlow was also insistent he was not a rapist but just an exhibitionist. at times, though, he seemed unsure himself. how many exposures? i don't know. i was charged with three to four indecent exposures of the same thing. it looked like i was trying to show a pattern of stalking women and then i raped this female. but no, i did not. i learned my lesson to respect women and don't be doing that unless it's -- now as a christian, i know i couldn't do that with somebody unless we were married. >> but whitlow had some recent write-ups to exposing himself, and not to someone he was married to but to prison nurses. >> i got written up for charges i didn't do, and of course i was mad about that. >> he tended to blame other people for his problems, but the fact of the matter was, he was exposing himself to nurses and to people, and then he would
talk about it, which, in a way, it's an affront to most inmates. >> the exposures, i know for a fact that were forced upon me, forcing me to be in my cell nude. my clothes were either stolen or getting lost, but the problems started to be fixed by the staff here. it's continuing to be corrected. >> we would try to conduct an interview and he would just keep going. and the manner in which he spoke, the way he conducted himself, it was just draining. it was absolutely draining. it was hard to keep him focused. >> you see there's no sheets? i got one blanket. i don't have any clothes, but that is not something i'm worried about because the lord in his word says we don't have to worry about clothes. they'll worry about that for me. i just do the best i can and that's what i'll do. i wouldn't disrespect you like that. i love you, man.
>> coming up -- >> i was arrested. he took me down to my jail where i worked. >> an ex-cop lands in one of america's toughest prisons. >> i'm old school. and it's very difficult, very, very difficult. d then you totaled him. you two had been through everything together. two boyfriends. three jobs. you're like "nothing can replace brad!" then liberty mutual calls. and you break into your happy dance. if you sign up for better car replacement, we'll pay for a car that's a model year newer with 15,000 fewer miles than your old one. see car insurance in a whole new light. liberty mutual insurance. just in case you were wondering what cheerios are made of whole. grain. oats.
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call 800-501-6000 to switch today. perks are nice. but the best thing you can give your business is comcast business. comcast business. built for business. coming to prison can be culture shock for almost anyone. when we met armand at california state prison corcoran, he was recovering from a shoulder surgery. but that didn't help ease the pain of being here after a 26-year career in law enforcement. >> worked in the patrol division, narcotics bureau, detective bureau. personnel training in the jails and then i was promoted to lieutenant in 1984. >> after retiring, he and a group of friends started a charitable foundation. they raised over $3 million in donations.
but then questions arose about where the money actually went. >> to make a long story short the judge said all of the money was raised was fraud even though we could show we gave away $70,000 to little league teams, hospitals, christmas drives, thanksgiving, easter basket drives. now it's all fraud money so because it's all fraud the $3.5 million is all income and by the way you owe several million dollars tax on that. >> after donating only $70,000 of the $3.5 million he raised, tiano was sentenced to almost 18 years in prison for fraud and embezzlement. >> it's one of those things that in the beginning it seemed surreal. as you go through it you start to devise ways to cope, or, go crazy. you know. i mean, it's no secret.
i mean, i'm not ashamed to say i thought of killing myself in the beginning. i didn't know if i could get through this. when i was arrested it took me down to my jail, where i worked, i've got guys that were working for me putting handcuffs on me. and they felt terrible. i mean, i had one guy tell me it's like putting handcuffs on my brother. >> the jury that convicted him believed that he used the millions of dollars he raised not to help others, but to live a life of luxury, purchasing houses, boats and sports cars. it's a very different lifestyle for tiano today. >> you have one little table there, you've got four walls, that are cement. you have a cement floor and no paint. a stainless steel toilet. you have to use the restroom where you often have to eat. there are two people most of the time in here. you can imagine. you have to go to the restroom here. it's just -- everything's just so -- i wasn't brought up that way, you know. i'm old school. it's very difficult. very, very difficult. >> not only was he former law enforcement, he still carried
himself like a cop. and here he was incarcerated in a pretty hard core prison, and i could see he hadn't come to terms with the fact he was once a law enforcement agent and now he was an inmate. he still obviously struggled with that fact. he was lucky he was put in a protective custody unit, otherwise he would be in grave danger. >> i wouldn't probably last five minutes on the main line. >> why? >> they don't like cops. you know. or ex-cops. >> tiano says if nothing else his experience here has helped him see the people he used to arrest in a new light. >> i've been dealing with these people for many, many years. and you know, there's a lot of them that aren't, i mean, you know, there's a perception, unfortunately, by the majority of our society that everybody is in prison is really a bad person.
and that's not the case. these -- my heart aches for some of these youngsters you see come in here, 21, 22 years old that are facing life sentences because of a stupid mistake. i mean, you just wonder how is this 22-year-old kid going to get through to age 65, 70, 75, 80, and this is it. i mean there's no more than this. this is all there is for him. i mean you can't help but have some empathy for that guy. >> how is your shoulder doing today? >> it's a little sore. i got it out of the sling, trying to get -- gets too stiff if i leave it in there all the time. >> for all of these years, for 26 years in law enforcement, you know, i've got a very good friend of mine who is a retired captain. we write. and i was telling him it's like that whole point in my life has been for naught because they took my retirement badge, my retirement i.d. card, i used to win gold medals at the police olympics all the time and those are gone. it just -- it guts you is what
it does. it just guts you. and you try, and, you know, hold that in as best you can, but there are times when it just kind of oozes its way out. you are looking for new band-aids. you know. everything was great. i was -- i was happy. >> during our brief time with armand tiana state prison records only listed his current fraud and embezzlement convictions. later we discovered that this was not the first time he was incarcerated. prior to his fraud trial, he was also convicted of molesting two teenage female relatives. he received a year in county jail and five years probation. a surprisingly light sentence for the disgraced police officer. prosecutors had asked for 15 years to life.
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